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 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 05:36 pm
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KrisS
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Hi,

I'm new to the Civil War research era .

My GG Grandfather was in  Wisconsin Reg 1st ,Comp. C . , Heavy Artillery.

On a Roster of Wisconsin Volunteers War of  the Rebellion 1861-1865

It has this:

 Name :  Perham Eugene

Residence: Mauston

 Date: July 20 , 63

 Remarks:  Corp, : absent in Mil. pris. at M O of Co.

Can anyone tell me what  the remarks mean.

Thank You



 




 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 05:55 pm
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Texas Defender
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KrisS-

  My best guess is that your ancestor was a Corporal, and he was absent at the Muster Order of his company because he was incarcerated in a military prison at that time. I'm not sure about the: "M O" part, but thats the general idea.

Editing:  Its obvious from Hellcat's postings that: "M O" means: "Mustering Out."

Last edited on Sat Feb 2nd, 2013 10:15 am by Texas Defender



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 06:35 pm
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KrisS
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Thank you.

 I didn't know if that meant that  he was tooken  prisoner of the confederates & their prision was in Missouri  some where..



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 07:18 pm
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Hellcat
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I checked the Civil War Soldiers and Sailors Database. All they say for his record is this: http://www.nps.gov/civilwar/search-soldiers-detail.htm?soldier_id=6cb74ec2-dc7a-df11-bf36-b8ac6f5d926a. Now according to this he was just a private, but you'd probably have to get the full record to learn more.

Page 3 of the regimental roster on the Wisconsin Geneology Trails website (http://genealogytrails.com/wis/1stWIHeavyArtilleryReg-roster3.html) says he was discharged rather than mustered out, which sounds like what TD was saying about military prison.

Edit: http://www.archives.com/GA.aspx?FirstName=Eugene&LastName=Perham&Location=WI&_act=registerAS&BirthYear=&DeathYear=&MarriageYear=&DivorceYear=&RecordType=5&SiteSource=&CollectionId=

If you join that site you should be able to read the record. They offer a free seven day membership

Last edited on Fri Feb 1st, 2013 07:34 pm by Hellcat



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 07:30 pm
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Texas Defender
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Hellcat-

  On the CWSS, it shows a man of the same name who was in a Wisconsin infantry regiment. It is probably the same person as the one in the artillery regiment, as so often happens on the CWSS, since many people served in more than one unit during the war. In both cases, it shows the man in as a private and out as a private, but he certainly could have been a corporal at one time who was reduced back to a private as a result of a disciplinary action.

 



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 07:43 pm
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Hellcat
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TD, the first time I did the search I just searched for a Eugene Perham from Wisconsin without selecting a function and it came up with the 1st Wisconsin Heavy Artillery, Co. C. As you say there could have been other men by that name, but I think the odds are good it's the same man. However, I think you'd have to get the roll to get the full record. It may be exactly what you said about being busted in rank.



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 07:59 pm
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Texas Defender
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Hellcat-

  The other listing for Eugene Perham is in Co I, 8th WI Infantry. The surname is very unusual, so its likely that it was the same person as the one in the artillery regiment.

  KrisS didn't give a middle initial for Perham, nor is there one for him on the CWSS. Nothing is given about what he did after the war, but this person who ended up in the west is the right age to have been the same guy.

Eugene L. Perham (1827 - 1891) - Find A Grave Memorial

 



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 08:34 pm
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Hellcat
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Ok, the Wisconsin Geneology Trails link above ain't working when I click it. Try this link and go to Jacobs to Perham

http://genealogytrails.com/wis/1stWIHeavyArtilleryReg.html



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 08:47 pm
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Texas Defender
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Perham, Eugene   Co.C     Jul2063   Enlisted    Sep2165     Discharged

  Looks like he was around at the end of the war.



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 08:49 pm
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Hellcat
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TD, I'm not sure their the same man. I went further into the Wisconsin Geneology Trails site and went to the 8th Wisconsin. Eugene Perham of the 8th Wisconsin was discharged in October 1862 "due to disability" (http://genealogytrails.com/wis/8thWIInfReg.html#roster, scoll down until you can click on the star beside Mellan - Shores to bring up the section of roster with him.) In the last link I gave to the site on the 1st Wisconsin Heavy Artillery it does say that Eugene Perham was mustered in or joined in July 1863. Now it could have been the same man. Depending on the disability and the scruples of the recruiter Perham could certainly have re-enlisted in the 1st. If so, I wonder if a disability could have been grounds for military prison.



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 09:00 pm
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Texas Defender
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Hellcat-

  Its all speculation at this point. It is possible that he had some injury in 1862 that had healed nine months later. Or, as you say, perhaps the medical folks in the artillery regiment were less picky than those in the infantry regiment.

  If there were two different men in the two regiments, its possible that they were first cousins. It was common practice for brothers to name their sons after their own brothers. But I am almost certain that it was the same person in both regiments.

  As for the prison angle, I have no idea.

 
  Checking the roster for the 8th WI Infantry that you provided, I note that as well as Eugene Perham, there was also a Victor Perham. Both were in Co. I, and both were discharged for disability in 1862. I don't find Victor in the WI artillery regiment. Here is Victor's memorial:

Victor Perham (1821 - 1890) - Find A Grave Memorial      Note that the person submitting the memorial is: "Kris." There seems to be a connection, which implies a connection to the Eugene also in the infantry regiment. Victor was born in 1821, and the Eugene candidate I showed earlier was born in 1827, so they could have been brothers. Victor was discharged from the 8th WI two months before Eugene, so it is possible that Eugene wanted out of that regiment.

Last edited on Fri Feb 1st, 2013 09:14 pm by Texas Defender



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 09:10 pm
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KrisS
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The Eugene Perham that is in the Wisconsin Reg. 8th Comp I is my GGG grandfather, I don't have a middle name for him. But he had a son Leroy Eugene.

Eugene father was in the same comp at the same time  Victor Perham was his name.

The Eugene in Comp C , Reg1st Heavy Artillery , I was thinking he might be him. But don't know that for sure.


 



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 09:23 pm
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Texas Defender
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KrisS-

  So, you are saying that Victor Perham is your GGGG grandfather? That would make the Eugene Perham born in 1827 (Died in 1891) much too young to be on a direct line to you.

  Do you have a date of birth (or death) for the Eugene Perham who is your GGG grandfather? Do you know what he did or where he went after the war?



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 09:43 pm
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KrisS
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Victor was born 1821

his son Eugene was born <1844> in N.Y.

All I have is a pension Rec .of where his wife filed.

I'll try to attach it.

In 1870 is the last I have him:

1870 Fed census , Mankato , Blue Earth , Minn

Im 5 , P. 586 (8) , date: 18th Jun , 1870

Purger Eugene , 26 , stone cutter , N.Y

Harriet , 20 , Al

Alistain Sarah , 46 , S.C.

By 1880 Hattie & the boys are living in Iowa & she is WD.

1880 Fed census ,dist. 5 , yell twp , Boone Co, Ia

Im 16 , P. 82 ,date: 19 Jun , 1880.

Perham Harriet , 30 , Wd. , Ala , S.C. , Va.

Eugene , 4 , Minn , Ny ,Al

Roy , 7 , Minn

Jean , 4 , IA

The pension card say Jul 1890? so I don't know if that means his death or when she applied for the pension.

Her obit says he died before 1880 & he was buried in texas. but haven't been able to find nothing on him since 1870.

Attachment: USCivilWarPensionIndexGeneralIndextoPensionFiles_439398591.jpg (Downloaded 47 times)



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 10:03 pm
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KrisS
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If he was reduce back in rank would he be able to draw his pension from Comp C or would it fall back on Comp I? I sent for his Records But asked for the Comp C's since that was the last one that I found ( :? Hopefully that is him)



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 10:20 pm
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Texas Defender
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KrisS-

  1890 is when Harriet applied for the pension. According to your 1880 Census info, she was a widow in 1880. Based on the ages of the children, Eugene must have died between 1875 and 1879.

  From what you said, Eugene had some kind of Texas connection and was buried here. I don't see an obvious location for his gravesite. Search groups like this one might be able to help....

http:/texas.archives.com/ 

   ....but of course there is no guarantee that they will find him, or that the info will be of much use to you if they do find him. 

Editing: I don't think that a reduction in rank would in itself ruin his widow's chances of getting a pension. If he was indeed in the artillery regiment, then he finished the war with them (Discharged in Sept. of 1865) and apparently served honorably.           

Last edited on Fri Feb 1st, 2013 10:24 pm by Texas Defender



 Posted: Fri Feb 1st, 2013 10:45 pm
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KrisS
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Thanks for all your help. I just hope the records I sent for has the info. to put the pieces together.



 Posted: Sat Feb 2nd, 2013 09:43 am
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Hellcat
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Texas Defender wrote:
  As for the prison angle, I have no idea.
 


But the idea makes sense. The roster for the 1st Wisconsin Heavy Artillery says the Eugene Perham there was discharged, not muster out. And there's no reason given for the discharge. You look at the page, he's one of the few listed as discharged who doesn't have a reason for the discharge listed. Most of those listed as discharged are either discharged due to disability or due to promotion (there is one dishonorable discharge listed on the page). But a handful don't have a reason for the discharge listed.

KrisS initial post did say the remarks stated

Corp, : absent in Mil. pris. at M O of Co.


I did find the roster he was talking about:

http://content.wisconsinhistory.org/cdm/ref/collection/tp/id/35350 (he's on page 265 of the book, scroll to page 273 of the site to get to page 265)

However, the thing is that I'm making a conjecture based on the two sources. The Roster of Wisconsin Volunteers, War of the Rebellion, 1861-1865. Volume I.
remarks that he was in a Mil. pris. at the time the company is mustered out and the Wisconsin Geneology roster says that he was discharged with no explination as to why. The two sources would seem to confirm he was in prison at the time the company was mustered out. But does that mean no reason given for the discharge means that was because he was ultimately discharged from prison?

Looking at the folks on the Wisconsin Geneology Trails roster without a reason for their discharge there's
  • H
  • iram Janes, Co. A
  • H
  • enry H Johnson, Co. E
  • H
  • enry Knapp, Co. A
  • S
  • eymour Lewis, Co. A
  • L
  • oren S Mallory, Co. A
  • J
  • ohn Martin, Co. E
  • J
  • ohn Maxwell, Co. A
  • L
  • awrence Mericle, Co. L
  • G
  • eorge Merwin, Co. A
  • A
  • lbert Morse, Co. C
  • G
  • eorge Murwin, Co. A
  • W
  • illiam Norwood, Co. D
  • H
  • ugh W Owens, Co. B
  • H
  • enry W Peck, Co. D
  • E
  • ugene Perham, Co. C

Now of that group Albert Morse is the quickest one to look up in the Roster of Wisconsin Volunteers, War of the Rebellion, 1861-1865. Volume I. if you're looking at page 265 of the book because he's on that page. The remarks on him say:

M. O. Sept. 21, '65

So he's mustered out according to the book but according to the geneology roster he's discharged. Which brings into question if Eugene Perhams discharge means because he was a prisoner or something else. Going backwards in the book the first we should come to on the list is Hugh Owens of Company B. Page 262 (270 of the site) has Owens on it and the remarks state:

Sergt.; prom. 1st Lieut. 12(?)h U.S.C.T., July 12, 1864

I can't tell what that question mark letter/number is, probably supposed to be the 12th USCT. But Owens isn't listed in the geneology as being discharged due to promotion or transfer.

Company A's George Murwin's remarks aren't any help as the book just says he's discharged. And the book says for George Merwin is to see George Murwin, which sounds like their the same person under two different spellings of their surname. Seymore Lewis is also listed simply as being discharged. John Maxwell in the book is listed as absent a the mustering out of the battery. Hiram Janes is also listed at being absent when the battery was mustered out. Loren Mallory is stated to be a muscian and discharged by orders in June 1862.

Henry Knapp is listed as a drummer and discharged in June 1861. Given the time there it sounds like he might have enlisted for maybe a couple of months (though he was still a couple days shy of two months at the time of discharge).

Moving forward in the book past Company C William Norwood of Company D is listed as being mustered out. Henry Peck is

Enl. Oct. 10, '63; disch. June 20, '65

Henry Johnson of Company E is mustered out in June 1865. John Martin is listed as absent when the battery is mustered out. And Larwence Mercile of Company L was simply listed as discharged in June 1865.

None of the others simply listed as discharged on the geneology site are listed as being in a military prison at the time their company is mustered out so that doesn't reinforce the conjecture. But it can't really be ruled out as a possile reason for why he's discharged instead of muster out with the rest of the company. The problem is that it's still conjecture.



 Posted: Sat Feb 2nd, 2013 10:25 am
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Hellcat-

  When in my Post #11 I said: "As for the prison angle, I have no idea," I was referring to your Post #10 where you wondered if a disability had something to do with Eugene being in prison.

  As to your present conjecture that he was in prison when the entire unit ended its service on 21 Sep 1865 and was discharged from there, you might well be right.



 Posted: Sat Feb 2nd, 2013 07:47 pm
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Remarks: Corp, : absent in Mil. pris. at M O of Co.

Is a reference to him being on detached duty as a prison guard or escorting prisoners to a POW camp. More likely the latter.

this would not have been uncommon, he mnight well have requested a hardship discharge if things back home took a turn for the worse.

 

Good info put forward by others, really good stuff.

Last edited on Sat Feb 2nd, 2013 07:51 pm by Johan Steele



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