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| U S Grant | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Fri Aug 21st, 2009 08:04 am |
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1st Post |
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fedreb Member 
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I have recently read Edward G Longacre's biography of Grant which talks a lot of the authors conviction that Grant was an alcoholic and cites many incidents during the war when he was reported to be under the influence. Myself I am not sure whether he was alcoholic or if he just enjoyed a good drink now and then as many of us indeed do. I have not read much about Grants Presidency ( any good book suggestions? ) and my question is this, are there many, or any, references to Grant being drunk in charge of the country? Surely if he was an alcoholic his cravings must have shown through sometime during his 8 year tenure, it is not something easily hidden.
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| Posted: Mon Aug 24th, 2009 07:47 am |
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2nd Post |
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cklarson Member
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I have waited for others to reply, but lacking others, I will. Here is a link to a googlebooks excerpt from Edward Bonekemper's biography of Grant which I think is quite judicious: http://books.google.com/books?id=JyNrLK3OSA4C&pg=PA259&lpg=PA He says that Grant may have had problems with liquor and seems to have drunk quite a bit as a young officer (out West), but he knows of no time he was accused of being drunk during battle. He believes rumors were circulated by those with various axes to grind. It was said that Grant's drinking, mainly when times were quiet, was a major reason Julia was in camp so often. She kept a rein on him. As for his presidency, I've not read of accusations then. But let's all keep in mind that all these men were men of their times. Prior to the Civil War Americans drank, per capita, 3 times what we do today, due to all the distilleries of rum and whiskey (it was cheaper to haul whiskey by the barrel than its equivalent amount in corn). The same goes for the charges of corruption during Grant's presidency: the whole era was exceedingly corrupt. I also find that people who don't drink a lot tend to confuse hard drinkers with alcoholics. My own distinction is that alcoholics are dysfunctional in their daily lives, while hard drinkers are not. For instance in her postwar life, US scout Pauline Cushman was accused of being an alcoholic, but she ran well managed hotels. Similarly, to my mind Grant could not have written the very clear, precise orders he did if his brain had been awash in alcohol. He also wrote his memoirs, considered the best of the war, while he was doped up on cocaine when dying of cancer. He had a very clear mind which could not have been the case had he been a real alcoholic. As one fan wrote, his genius was his "sincere, applied thought." And, of course, there is Lincoln's (who was a teetotaler) best line: Find out what brand he drinks and send a case to all the other generals. CKL
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| Posted: Mon Aug 24th, 2009 02:19 pm |
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3rd Post |
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fedreb Member
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Thanks for that CKL. There are many stories about Grants drinking habits but a lot of them are many times removed from original sources and I tend to treat them with some scepticism. I don't doubt that the man liked a drink and that his detractors used that against him but I just couldn't see how he could have risen to the Presidency, twice, had he been truly alcoholic.
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| Posted: Tue Aug 25th, 2009 06:29 am |
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4th Post |
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cklarson Member
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You'll read in his memoirs that Grant had good political judgment. E.g., his decision to take Vicksburg from the Miss R. after his supply base at Holly Springs was taken was partly made on political grounds--that the Northern people needed to see action and results. I also believe his keen mind was part of the reason he was not successful in business. He had a penetrating mind, not and expansive, imaginative one needed in business. CKL
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| Posted: Tue Aug 25th, 2009 12:14 pm |
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5th Post |
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Mr Hess53 Member 
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cklarson wrote: And, of course, there is Lincoln's (who was a teetotaler) best line: Find out what brand he drinks and send a case to all the other generals. CKL hate to say it, but Lincoln never said that line about Grant plus Abe was known to have a glass of wine at State dinners every now and then
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| Posted: Tue Aug 25th, 2009 03:22 pm |
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6th Post |
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ole Member 
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hate to say it, but Lincoln never said that line about Grant He probably didn't. But it does fit nicely into who Lincoln was. If it isn't true, it ought to be. Although it isn't documented that he did, it is quite impossible to prove that he didn't ... proving the negative and all that. Grant's enemies, and he had more than a few, were most likely using the drinking to diminish his obviously positive qualities. These accusations come down to us, today, to detract from the man who was arguably, and also probably, the single-most important factor in the reason the Confederacy lost its bid for independence. If he did drink to excess, it didn't seem to keep him from being a winner. Ole Last edited on Tue Aug 25th, 2009 03:23 pm by ole |
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| Posted: Tue Aug 25th, 2009 04:27 pm |
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7th Post |
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javal1 Grumpy Geezer 
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"Grant's enemies, and he had more than a few, were most likely using the drinking to diminish his obviously positive qualities. " Halleck and Buell come immediately to mind.
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