Civil War Interactive Discussion Board Home
Home Search search Menu menu Not logged in - Login | Register


New Clues to Hunley Sinking - General Civil War Talk - Civil War Talk - Civil War Interactive Discussion Board
 Moderated by: javal1 Page:    1  2  Next Page Last Page  
 New Topic   Reply   Printer Friendly 
 Rate Topic 
AuthorPost
 Posted: Sat Jul 15th, 2006 11:52 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
1st Post
javal1
Grumpy Geezer


Joined: Thu Sep 1st, 2005
Location: Tennessee USA
Posts: 1503
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Folks,

This will be in Monday's CWi news section, but I thought I'd post it here now....

Clue found in mystery of Civil War sub
Confederate crew may have opened hatch on historic Hunley

CHARLESTON, S.C. - Scientists say they may have found an important clue in the mystery of why the Confederate submarine Hunley sank 140 years ago after making history by sinking an enemy warship in battle.

Archaeologists and others working to restore the submarine recovered six years ago from the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean off the coast of Sullivans Island have found evidence the forward hatch may have been opened intentionally on the night the sub sank. MORE>>>>



 Posted: Sat Jul 15th, 2006 10:29 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
2nd Post
susansweet2
Member
 

Joined: Thu Feb 9th, 2006
Location:  
Posts: 98
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Joe thanks for the information.  I am always looking for more information on the Hunley.  I am hoping in two months when I go to Charleston to finally see it.  Can any one tell me other favorite South Carolina places to see for sure  while I am there.  I have been to Fort Sumter and Fort Moultrie.  Where else should I not miss.  I will be there two weeks about 60 miles north of Charleston.  My friend says they will take me where ever I want to go in the state .  I have said I want to see Tea Plantation , Rice Plantation, Hunley and Savannah. (I know it is Georgia) .  Any thing else that is not to be missed? 



 Posted: Sat Jul 29th, 2006 12:02 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
3rd Post
Harry
Member


Joined: Sat Oct 1st, 2005
Location: Key West, Florida USA
Posts: 27
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

A good friend of mine was one of the original archaeologists on the Hunley project. When I first saw that story on the AP wire, I emailed it to him. He replied that the team had figured that out when they first examined the Hunley after it was brought back to Charleston. They didn't discount that theory, but chose to pursue other theories about the demise of the sub.



 Posted: Sun Oct 19th, 2008 12:06 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
4th Post
The Iron Duke
Member


Joined: Tue Jul 29th, 2008
Location: Georgia USA
Posts: 333
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

"Scientists found the eight-man crew of the hand-cranked Confederate submarine had not set the pump to remove water from the crew compartment, which might indicate it was not being flooded.

That could mean crew members suffocated as they used up air, perhaps while waiting for the tide to turn and the current to help take them back to land."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27251852/



____________________
"Cleburne is here!" meant that all was well. -Daniel Harvey Hill


 Posted: Sun Oct 19th, 2008 04:14 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
5th Post
Crazy Delawares
Member


Joined: Fri Feb 22nd, 2008
Location: New Jersey USA
Posts: 143
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

WOW!!! This is going to stir up more interest. It sure goes a ways toward explaining some things.



 Posted: Sun Oct 19th, 2008 04:26 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
6th Post
Captain Crow
Proud Southerner


Joined: Sun Jul 13th, 2008
Location: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma USA
Posts: 542
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Last year when I visited the lab where the Hunley is being restored, the man who served as our tour guide(and also works with the research and restoration team) was kind enough to answer a few of my questions including how the crew perished. He was fairly tight lipped about details but was also quite emphatic in stating that evidence from the bodies of the crew indicated that they had not drowned.



 Posted: Sun Oct 19th, 2008 05:04 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
7th Post
Dixie Girl
Southern Belle


Joined: Thu Oct 25th, 2007
Location: North Carolina USA
Posts: 850
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

ive seen something on this on tv.......now i ask you what kinda idiot would open a hatch in a submarine while underwater????? yall my little brother who is 10 would know that you dont do something like that under water unless you wanna die.



____________________
War Means Fighting And Fighting Means Killing - N. B. Forrest When war does come, my advice is to draw the sword and throw away the scabbard." Stonewall Jackson


 Posted: Sun Oct 19th, 2008 09:05 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
8th Post
pamc153PA
Member
 

Joined: Sat Jun 14th, 2008
Location: Boyertown, Pennsylvania USA
Posts: 407
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Would love to have been a fly on the wall in that sub. . . as long as I could escape out that forward hatch before it was too late!

Pam



 Posted: Sun Oct 19th, 2008 10:16 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
9th Post
susansweet
Member


Joined: Sun Sep 4th, 2005
Location: California USA
Posts: 1420
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Notice the date of the open hatch information it is two years old.  They have now decided it was not opened.   I was reading the article on the value that is not in the right position now .  The thought is they suffocated. 
I never tired of visiting the Hunley.  Standing above it in it's water bath looking down is always an emotional moment for me.  I don't think I will have time to visit this year when I am there and that really disappoints me .

Susan

Last edited on Sun Oct 19th, 2008 10:20 pm by susansweet



 Posted: Sun Oct 19th, 2008 11:19 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
10th Post
Johan Steele
Life NRA,SUVCW # 48,Legion 352


Joined: Sat Dec 2nd, 2006
Location: South Of The North 40, Minnesota USA
Posts: 1065
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Dixie Girl wrote: ive seen something on this on tv.......now i ask you what kinda idiot would open a hatch in a submarine while underwater????? yall my little brother who is 10 would know that you dont do something like that under water unless you wanna die.
Dixie... death by suffocation or death by drowning.  One is fairly quick the other is not.



 Posted: Sun Oct 19th, 2008 11:34 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
11th Post
Johan Steele
Life NRA,SUVCW # 48,Legion 352


Joined: Sat Dec 2nd, 2006
Location: South Of The North 40, Minnesota USA
Posts: 1065
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

susansweet2 wrote: Joe thanks for the information.  I am always looking for more information on the Hunley.  I am hoping in two months when I go to Charleston to finally see it.  Can any one tell me other favorite South Carolina places to see for sure  while I am there.  I have been to Fort Sumter and Fort Moultrie.  Where else should I not miss.  I will be there two weeks about 60 miles north of Charleston.  My friend says they will take me where ever I want to go in the state .  I have said I want to see Tea Plantation , Rice Plantation, Hunley and Savannah. (I know it is Georgia) .  Any thing else that is not to be missed? 

You have to see Angel Oak, 20- min South of Charleston.  Make certain you get good directions.  She's the oldest oak in North America.  I'm also very fond of the Blind Tiger/Four Corners Cafe... Then there is that Aircraft Carrier just across from the Cusoms House... last time I was there they were serving the menu from the same day in 1943 in the mess hall.

My better half's family is from Kingstree.... and one of my best friends and I used to visit Charleston at every opportunity.  A beautiful city.

Last edited on Sun Oct 19th, 2008 11:36 pm by Johan Steele



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 12:08 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
12th Post
susansweet
Member


Joined: Sun Sep 4th, 2005
Location: California USA
Posts: 1420
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Johan, I wrote that post before I even went to South Carolina I have now been there four times. I am going again in December thanks to my friend there. I have seen the aircraft carrier, that is at Patriots Point . That is where I will catch the boat to go to Fort Sumter . We are going to visit the Fort although I have been there as I want to see it in December when Anderson went over there from Moultrie . Angel Oak where is that ? I have been to McClellanville and seen the old tress there . One is an ancient tree but I don't remember what it is . I will be in Manning 60 miles from Charleston. I am hoping I will get to Charleston a couple of times at least . I am dependent on my friends to get around as I won't have a car .

Thanks though for the information. Always interested in finding new places to visit there. One thing I need to do is get some palmetto roses to take home to a friend. She likes mine that the family gave me.
Susan



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 01:44 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
13th Post
ole
Member


Joined: Sun Oct 22nd, 2006
Location:  
Posts: 2027
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

death by suffocation or death by drowning.  One is fairly quick the other is not.
Oxygen deprivation has been known to cause strange behavior. (For one, you might not even know it is happening.) It might be conceivable that the last one awake was so addled that he opened the hatch.

Just speculating.

ole



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 02:34 am
   PM  Quote  Reply 
14th Post
susansweet
Member


Joined: Sun Sep 4th, 2005
Location: California USA
Posts: 1420
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Interesting thought Ole.  Makes sense .

Susan



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 05:49 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
15th Post
calcav1
Member
 

Joined: Tue Nov 20th, 2007
Location: Corinth, MS
Posts: 48
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Unless the Hunley was running a few inches below the waterline there is no way the crew could have opened the hatch. The water pressure outside the hull would make it virtually impossible to open the hatch if they are only a foot below the surface.

Tom



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 06:16 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
16th Post
javal1
Grumpy Geezer


Joined: Thu Sep 1st, 2005
Location: Tennessee USA
Posts: 1503
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Spot on Calcav. I'm not sure anyone knows exactly how deep the Hunley was at the time of "the incident". But a general rule of thumb would be pressure equals depth times 15 divided by 33. Keep in mind the configuration of the Hunley, which would allow at most 1 or 2 men access to try to open the hatch, and you see that it would be downright impossible.



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 09:00 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
17th Post
ole
Member


Joined: Sun Oct 22nd, 2006
Location:  
Posts: 2027
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

I'd guess one real question would be how deep did she run? My understanding is that she sailed very low in the water so as to be virtually invisible at night, but that she would be clearly visible during the day. In other words, not deep.

With Javal's formula, one foot of water over the hatch would equal 15 pounds (per sqare inch?) divided by 33. That's a skosh less than a half pound per square inch.

Next question: how big is the hatch? If, shall we say, it's as large as 20 x 20 (400 square inches), the force required to open the hatch would be 180 pounds. Doable.

Two feet down, the force required would be near 400 pounds. I suppose that's possible, but I don't think they would have crewed a sub with that kind of hulk. Three feet down -- forget it.

So it would come back to the question: How deep did she run?

ole

Last edited on Mon Oct 20th, 2008 09:09 pm by ole



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 09:16 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
18th Post
javal1
Grumpy Geezer


Joined: Thu Sep 1st, 2005
Location: Tennessee USA
Posts: 1503
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

Wouldn't argue with any of your post Ole, just two caveats:

1) Don't forget to add the weight of the hatch itself to the psi calculation.

2) remember, they were probably in a somewhat weakened state by the time this occurred.



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 09:24 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
19th Post
Texas Defender
Member


Joined: Sat Jan 27th, 2007
Location: Texas USA
Posts: 920
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

  What I believe happened is that the HUNLEY nosed into the bottom, perhaps from the shock wave of the explosion onboard the HOUSITANIC, or for some other reason. I believe that the crew attempted to crank in reverse to free the boat, but they were unable to do so. They probably passed out and expired in less than 30 minutes. There was never a chance to open the hatch due to water pressure.



 Posted: Mon Oct 20th, 2008 10:21 pm
   PM  Quote  Reply 
20th Post
Captain Crow
Proud Southerner


Joined: Sun Jul 13th, 2008
Location: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma USA
Posts: 542
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 

  back to top

In fact Dixon and co. did actually take her to the bottom and sit just to test the length of time they could stay down w/o surfacing. I seem to recall their candle went out around 25 minutes.

And I must concur that Charleston is a beautiful city.
The Isle of palms at sunrise is not to be missed. You can never go wrong with a quiet stretch of white sand beach and sound of the Atlantic ocean in your ears.



 Current time is 02:06 pmPage:    1  2  Next Page Last Page  
Top




UltraBB 1.17 Copyright © 2007-2008 Data 1 Systems
Page processed in 0.4409 seconds (9% database + 91% PHP). 28 queries executed.